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More than half of working Americans still aren’t comfortable necessarily sharing their caregiving responsibilities at work. And I would certainly have put myself in that category 10 years ago.

 

Caring for aging parents or other loved ones while working, raising children and trying to live your own life, wondering how to find the time for your personal health and happiness. Well, you’re in the right place. Welcome to the Happy Healthy Caregiver podcast to show where real family caregivers share how to be happy and healthy while caring for others. Now, here’s your host, Family Caregiver and certified caregiving consultant, Elizabeth Miller.

 

Hi there. Thanks for tuning in to the Happy Healthy Caregiver podcast, which is part of the whole care network. If this is your first time listening, I want to welcome you. I am so glad you’re here. This is a show produced biweekly to help family caregivers integrate self care and caregiving into their lives. We throw a lot of information at you. So don’t worry about it just in, enjoy the listen and know that you can check out all the resources and all the information on the accompanying show notes page. You can go to Happy healthy caregiver. com, go to the podcast menu, then click the image or the episode number for today’s show.

 

We’re also going to make that link available to you in your podcast platforms, episode description. I’ve got two announcements to share with you today. One is I’m hoping that you’re thinking about coming to cruise with us. We are excited about the self care at sea cruise that’s happening in October of 210 myself and other care Preneurs co-host have come together to try to strike a great deal so that caregivers can get the respite that they need or anyone that’s seeking self care. This is for all cruisers and anybody who’s interested.

 

And we want to give you a great deal. We want to give you the resources, we want to give you the opportunity to connect with other caregivers on the cruise and then leave with new friends in the caregiving space. Learn more about this wonderful opportunity at bit dot Lee forward slash HHC self care cruise. This topic is very relevant for our podcast today. I’m wondering if your company has an employee resource group and is looking for support and resources for your, er G. That is something that I definitely do.

 

I provide one time virtual or in person webinars, educational webinars that we’ve been storytelling. I can also facilitate caregiving panels, lead monthly group coaching calls and do a lot more to support the er G in your organization. I’m excited that employers are starting to get that working family caregivers really need their support. If you think that this is something that your employer could really benefit from, perhaps send them my speaker demo reel. I will attach that in the show notes page and I would love to just set up a call to have a brief conversation so that we can learn more about each other.

 

I’d like to thank our episode sponsor, Rare Patient Voice. Do you want to earn cash in exchange for your opinion? Rare patient voice are our PV? Helps connect researchers with patients and family caregivers for over 22019 diseases and conditions for patients and caregivers. R PV provides the opportunity to voice their opinions, to improve medical products and services while earning cash rewards, rare patient voice, helping patients and caregivers share their voices if you’re interested. Join the R PV panel at Rare Patient voice. com/happy healthy caregiver. I finished a book recently called the Shoemaker’s wife by Adriana Trigiani.

 

I’ve read other books by her and love them. So, was excited when my girlfriend picked this for our book club warning, you’re going to be hungry for Italian food and culture. When you read this book, it’s an epic novel. And the audio warning also was pretty long because it spans decades and continents as a caregiver, it’ll allow you to escape your life and get wrapped up in someone else’s life that is set in the early 21000th century. It’s a slow pace, but I think this may be what I needed and maybe it’s what you need.

 

Some of the themes include immigration, poverty, family loss, the opera, hard work and locations from the Italian Alps to New York City and Minnesota. This was the first time I did a combo kindle and audio book to finish the book in time for our book club discussion. It was long, but I’m giving it four out of five stars on Goodreads. The favorite thing I want to share with you is a sandal that is really super kind to my feet. Lately. It was recommended by somebody on my pickleball team because I’ve been having some issues with my feet, maybe like some achilles tendonitis type of stuff.

 

Definitely some inflammation. She recommended this sandal called S it’s a lightweight recovery sandal that reduces the stress on the feet and the joints and it’s washable. UFOs claims that their sandals absorb over 21100% of the impact of traditional foam shoes. I was so glad also that I had my s when I went on vacation and suddenly found that after going to the, er, they discovered I had a blood clot behind my knee, which was greatly impacting my walking ability. The s were the best things that I could have had on my feet.

 

At that time, I was limping. I was in a lot of pain. You know, I am on a prescription medication and looking at the time of this recording, I don’t know necessarily the cause of the blood clot. But um all in all really grateful that I’m kind of over the hump at least of the pain part right now and that I had my ufos frankly, that helped me on this journey. It’s been my preferred shoe to have been walking in when I’ve had these pickleball issues. And also with that, um that health scare issue that I had.

 

Let’s meet today’s caregiver in the spotlight, Gene Lanzoni’s life centers around caregiving both at home and at work as an only child. Gene and his wife for over 210 years, Elizabeth took on the responsibility of caring for his aging parents professionally. J leads the development of thought leadership research and produces content on caregiver trends. He’s also a co-lead and founding member of a caregiver focused employee resource group or er g in this episode of the Happy Healthy Caregiver podcast. We’re going to discuss the origins of their, er G and the numerous benefits it offers to both employers and employees and we explore how gene’s spiritual self care practices and his love of coffee have helped him navigate the challenges of caregiving. I hope you enjoyed the show.

 

Hi, Gene. Welcome to the Happy Healthy Caregiver podcast. Hi, Elizabeth. Great to be here. I am excited about our conversation and we’re going to get into it. But first, I’d like to get your thoughts on some something that we’re gonna pull out from the Happy healthy caregiver jar here. And um these are, this PDF is available if people, people want to make their own jar. But this is love to get your thoughts on this. It says, oh, it’s nice and short and sweet Gene.

 

It says storms don’t last forever. Yeah, storms don’t last forever. How do you think that pertains to caregiving? Well, I think it’s the right attitude. Uh It’s a, it’s an attitude of hope, right? Um So remaining positive and remembering why you’re doing what you’re doing as a caregiver, right? That for most people, the motivation is it’s an act of love. Um And so yes, I think that it’s important to remember that, you know, it, it all of those trials and tribulations and difficulties along the way will end.

 

What you’ll remember is all the love and care that you gave and the time that you spent with that person. Uh that will be so long lasting and so meaningful. Yeah, I think it’s, I think that’s a good way to put it. And, um, and I think that’s true, we’re hitting, you know, the 210 year anniversary of my dad’s death is, is approaching and it is, it’s kind of, it’s kind of like almost to like having a kid. You only remember the good parts of the pregnancy and all of that.

 

Um, but they stick with you. You remember it was hard I think. And you remember some of the struggles that at a level. But um that’s not what kind of shines through I think is, is I would agree with that. I um you, you have it interesting and I, I purposely didn’t mention this before because I was curious, like I know people listening to this who know me um are gonna recognize a last name of Lanzoni because uh I’m from Pennsylvania originally. I’m one of one of six kids and my mom, not my birth dad, but my mom’s first husband.

 

So my older four siblings, his name was Basil Lanzoni. So yeah, so small world. Um So I don’t know if you have any relatives in Brockway, Pennsylvania. We do actually and I actually took a trip there. So this is, this is a story about kind of holding on to those happy times and remembering all the good. So we, my wife and I took my parents out to Brockway P a, to see where my father was born and it was a very small little town which is not even on the map.

 

You can’t find this. It’s called Tickle Back. I have not even heard of that. And I love the, I bet you have it, but we, we found it, we found it and as we were driving down the street and this was some 5003 years ago, uh, he actually recognized a relative walking down the street. So we actually had a chance to stop and they had a conversation. But, um, yeah, that was amazing. And yes, we do have Lanzoni in, in Brockway, Pennsylvania. So, how about that? Interesting. Yeah. Basil Paul, I don’t, his dad’s name was maybe Francis.

 

I don’t know. Like I, yeah. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. Like, you know, Basil Anthony, um, Paul was his brother. Their family lived right off of the park there and we still have some cousins. So, yeah, small, small world of, um, land zoning. I’m sure I’ll have to tell my SIB siblings that we definitely connected and, um, have some, some roots that tie up there together. What was your dad’s name, by the way, in case they kind of know the family tree. I’m Junior. So he was Eugene Francis senior and I’m Eugene Francis Junior and my son is the third. Wow.

 

Very cool. And I told my son you can, you can end it there. Well, I know you all are eating. Well, I’m gonna say that like with all the ital, all the good Italian food that came into my life came from that part of the family. So, um, so cool. Well, you’re also Jan, I think I’m gonna call you and this isn’t a bad thing, but it’s a cereal, caregiver. A cereal family caregiver. Like, meaning that you just like, it just keeps finding you right. Tell us a little bit about your, your caregiving story and your experience and, and it’s really quite deep.

 

Yeah, and it keeps going as you say. Uh Yeah, so um I’m an only child, which is important because I think, you know, in doing a lot of work with caregivers over the last few years, I know that having siblings can be a a blessing and and also can be a challenge uh when it comes to dividing up the caregiving duties, right? So I knew from obviously very early on that when it came to caring for my parents, it was going to be me. Um So I’m an only child, my wife, um Elizabeth um is a saint.

 

Um And so I, I call her Saint Elizabeth. She has been incredible in terms of just supporting uh me and, and all that I needed to do for, for my parents knowing that I was an only child. But uh I would say caregiving and, and this is something that I hope we get to talk about. But in the work that I’m doing at Guardian, which, um, maybe we’ll talk more about later as a co-lead of our caregiving. Er, g, uh, one of the things that we’ve really focused on is trying to help the organization and our colleagues understand that caregiving is not just about caring for the elderly, but there is a, there is that misperception internally when we launched it that, oh, that’s if you’re caring for elderly parents or sick parents or, you know, maybe Children with special needs, but it’s not really for just parents of young Children who are caregivers too.

 

And so, uh we’ve been spending a good part of the last couple of years trying to educate the organization that no, there’s a lot of great benefits and resources and policies that Guardian has put in place and a lot of conversations we’re having with the care, er, G can be beneficial to parents as well of young Children. I mean, a lot of the speaking that I do for, er GS is really, um, it, sometimes there are parents and caregivers, er, g, they kind of call it out, put it together, but call it out specifically to kind of avoid that confusion.

 

Um, and I think that there’s some misconceptions about caregivers too when it comes to we think automatically of physical care. But there’s a lot of mental mental health um care that also goes on. Yes. And sometimes those invisible things are harder, are harder to identify even as a, as a family caregiver. Um Well, I mentioned that I, I mentioned that about including parents of young Children as caregivers because that’s where my caregiving journey began. Right? So we had three Children, we had three Children within the first five years of marriage.

 

And, uh I know lots of people today on my team and, and elsewhere and guardian who uh in the same situation, right? Children very quickly and that can be challenging, that can be overwhelming. And there’s some statistics recently in a report that we’re about to release a guardian uh called mind body wallet that talks about the 2500% increase that we’ve seen in disability claims that are related to post uh uh uh ma post maternity stress. So I think that’s, that’s just, yeah, that, that’s just something that we’re seeing increasing really dramatically over the last few years.

 

And it just means that, you know, this is a joyful moment. Uh this is a wonderful life event, but it can be complex and it can be overwhelming, right? For many. And so that’s just something to, to, to keep in mind. And so there are resources, uh there are things that employers are doing to help ease that transition uh for new moms and and new dads as well. But back when, back when I became a parent, that was not the case. So when you think about that era, you know, my which was a long time ago.

 

You were just supposed to kind of tough it out. Like what if you need a manual for how to be a parent, maybe you shouldn’t be a parent, you know, that was kind of the attitude like you, you just need to toughen up. And so there really wasn’t a lot of support back then. So I mentioned that because today there’s definitely more support and so colleagues who need that. Um I think there’s more available today. And I think since the pandemic, I think that’s been kind of a tipping point in terms of uh workplace policies around paid leave, around parental bonding leave.

 

Um So that’s all been helpful and I think it’s there and and and colleagues should take advantage of that anyway. So that’s where my, that’s where my caregiving journey began caring for three young Children. But while they were still very young at the ages of eight and six and five, my wife was diagnosed with cancer. Oh my goodness. So I was not only caring then for three Children, but also was caring for my wife during a year of chemo and radiation. Um Unfortunately, within the Lanzoni family, cancer um was present in, in particular, uh I lost an aunt in her thirties to breast cancer.

 

And I know that the impact that had on their family and my cousins. So she was a mother of three, losing her at that young of an age. So that was all going through my mind as my 220 year old wife was going through chemo and with our young Children trying to keep kind of shield them from a lot of that and what was really going on. Uh Fortunately they were young enough that that wasn’t that difficult to do. Um but they saw and they, they, they could see that she was obviously suffering.

 

So that was difficult. But that was, you know, um what kind of support did you get during that time? Like for you, as most people talk about the support was uh the outpouring of support was incredible. Um So many people just be coming out of the woodwork, you would expect family but people that we didn’t even know from the children’s school, from church, you know, everywhere all walks. I mean, everybody was just so helpful, so supportive, anything they could do. Um So we think it’s unique to that diagnosis in particular that at point of work because that doesn’t necessarily happen with a lot of, you know, like, oh my caring for someone with COPD or someone, you know, um yeah, different diseases or stroke or, I don’t know, hopefully not, like hopefully it doesn’t matter.

 

It’s, you know, if you’re well connected in the community, they’re, they’re going to show up for you. I think so. But, you know, maybe it does have something to do with a young mom with three young Children and there’s probably, you know, people feeling even more empathy, um, from the school especially. Right. So, other moms, you know, where they, they knew her, they knew our family, they knew our kids really well. So they probably wanted to try and do a little bit more. Uh, yeah. So that was, so that was kind of, you know, by SS. Yeah.

 

So probably should cut to the end of the story now just to make people hang and they’re like what happened. No. Exactly. Yeah. So it’s uh that was in 27 uh that was 1999. So yeah, she’s 25 years. Amazing. I’m so, yeah. Yeah. Yeah, 25 years this year. Um So then within about five years of my wife being in remission, um we have parents and uh her parents were in their seventies, mine were in their eighties at that point uh in the early two thousands and uh we knew they were going to need care.

 

Uh Her parents had health issues uh already in their uh late sixties, early seventies and my parents were getting older. And so we bought a house that our long term care policy was buying a house that had an in-law suite. So we just knew we were gonna all be living together as a solo caregiver, solo. I mean, an only child. So you can so that, that’s what we chose to do and um we used it so over a nine year period. We had at least one parent living with us for a nine year period. Yeah.

 

Uh, and, you know, that was, as we kind of said, at the outset, wonderful in so many ways, but obviously also, um, draining in many ways. Uh, but we talk about it to this day. My wife and I wouldn’t do it any other way. Absolutely. I was 00. Were your kids helping? They’re obviously seeing you hands on care. They had some role, you know, probably the greatest benefit is exactly that just what they saw, what they witnessed, you know, and, and being part of, you know, my parents and her parents’ lives right to the end as opposed to, you know, needing to visit that and, you know what I mean?

 

And it works differently for everybody and, you know, not everyone is in a position to do it. Not everyone can do it maybe financially or otherwise it works better if you can, you know, uh, use a facility. But for us, um, we, we felt really blessed that we could afford to do it, that we had the ability to do it and that our kids were able to be a part of that. Yeah. So they, so my parents and her parents were in their lives at the very end. Wow. Wow.

 

Yeah, I, I mean, there’s a lot of options out there for people. So I like to kind of spotlight the different options that caregivers have and depending on your situation, some things work better than others. It’s nice to hear you wouldn’t do it differently. I think that we want to live without regrets and I know that it wasn’t like we’re kind of given the cliff notes version of it. Uh, but it’s, you know, there, there are some tough peaks and valleys of, of this, these years together, 99 years, particularly when you’re at a multigenerational home.

 

Like, what, what got you through some of the tough times, Jan, I mean, I can remember, um, there’s a, there’s like two instances as you were just talking that like, still come to mind. One is, um, I remember there was some issues at work, you know, some management shake up and I was a little feeling a little bit uneasy about, you know, the situation at work and I came home one night and there were the kids were, you know, there was some issues with the kids and my mother started to have dementia toward the end.

 

And, uh, I just remember walking into the house and it was just like chaos and, uh, I was just like wiped out from a and I commuted, you know, an hour and a half each way to work. So it was a very long day as most of them were back then and just walking into that. And I remember being in a, uh, I was just like we lay down with my mom at night to help when she would go to sleep and we’d pray together. And, uh, I, I remember her saying something about the commode needed to be empty.

 

So I was like, I, I just, I just put my head down. We just thought, yeah. And it was like, and I just, that, that moment for some reason and I’ve repeated that about the emptying of the commode. Like, you’re like, that’s a buzz kill of the end of the day. Yeah. So there’s that. So, you know, um there’s that, I think, you know, memories though of um like birthdays and celebrating all together when we’re all, I mean, it’s, there were crazy times but they were great times just the fact that we could share all of those moments together, you know, they were all, they were just there.

 

Uh when my and my kids were helpful, when you asked about that, I should give them more credit. So, yes, they did. They, they stepped up quite often um to help in any way that they could do. You have any tips for someone who’s maybe thinking about this multigenerational home idea, like anything that you’d want them to know before they kind of go in, in on this, you know, I, I, as I said, I think it depends on the situation. Uh given that we had the room and the space, I think that made a huge difference, right?

 

So by the time my mom passed she was the last to pass. Um, you know, I had two teenagers and one who was like, 10 or so. And, you know, I think, um, the fact that we had so much room and space in the house, I think the kids felt like they could still, like, live their life and have, we, we still could have friends over. It wasn’t like that the whole house was devoted to, you know, caring for my parents. So I think that’s one of the reasons why it was, it was doable uh and didn’t disrupt, you know, the family life too much.

 

But, you know, I, I do think um e every situation is different. So you have to kind of do what works for you. And, you know, again, sibling support is kind of key and that plays a role in whether you make a decision to, you know, do it in your home or provide care elsewhere. I think that’s, that’s also important. So for me having my wife who was playing this huge role, right? I couldn’t have done it. I could not have done this and thankfully shared health was back, you know, in a, in a good spot.

 

I mean, can you imagine? No, the um jean, you know, you talk about, you’ve obviously had much experience as a man who’s working corporate environment while you’re caregiving. Like, what are some of the things, you know, free now? Like back then that were helpful to you at work or is that, is that how we got to this point of needing, needing things like, er GS? That’s how we got to this point. Yeah. So it was not, uh, I, here’s a story that I do tell, um, which really speaks to how far we’ve come, you know, even in the last 203 years.

 

So, uh, my mother passed away 11 years ago and, uh when she passed away, uh she had an episode in our house, I had just finished up working on a project that was like a 6 to 9 month project working with this large cross functional team. And we were reporting out the findings to senior leadership this particular day. Of course, it’s all coming together, of course. And uh so I was right in the middle of presenting when I got a phone call that my mother, you know, was brought to the hospital and they weren’t sure if she was going to make it through the night.

 

So at that point, I could either just walk out of the room and somebody had literally had to come up to me while I was in the front of this room with all of the senior executives there and tap me on the shoulder and just call me over to the side and tell me this and then I had to make a decision. And at the time I, I’m looking out at my boss and my boss’s boss and thinking this would not go over well if I were to leave the room right now.

 

So I finished the presentation and uh I did make it back to the hospital before my mom passed. But I tell that story because today I think, you know, the culture at Guardian as well as many other companies hopefully is, is very different um that there would be a lot more empathy and understanding in that situation. And I think that’s evidence in the benefits and the policies that have changed and also, and the resources that are made available. And then also, as you talked about, you know, employee resource groups that are there for people to be able to share.

 

So there’s a lot of data and we have a report on uh caregiving trends in America and we talk about the fact that more than half of working Americans still aren’t comfortable necessarily sharing their caregiving responsibilities at work. And I would certainly have put myself in that category 10 years ago. So my boss had no idea and in fairness to them. So this, I’m taking responsibility for this too. I wasn’t comfortable sharing it. Well, you were worried about the stigma and some of the, you know, everybody’s company at a different level even now.

 

So, you know, would you be passed up for opportunities, maybe they’re making assumptions that gene can’t handle this and, and that’s affecting, affecting your, your um you know, the choices that you have and to put it in front of you. So I think, you know, we have hopefully in, in a lot of ways we’ve come a long way. But for those of you that those that are listening, they have never heard of an employee resource group, just maybe share a little bit about. What is that? Yeah. So it, it’s essentially forming communities right, within your workforce.

 

So people who have similar challenges, uh similar interests, similar needs um providing them with safe space to share, to talk about those experiences, to learn from each other um in ways that just weren’t necessarily available before. Uh So for, and we have nine of them at Guardian, we have nine employee resource groups dedicated to colleagues who have disabilities to colleagues who identify as LGBT Q uh colleagues who are Asian American colleagues who are Hispanic, all of these different groups where they can, you know, just share and, and learn from each other and also provide feedback to Guardian leadership about what their needs are and what would be beneficial from an hr from a policy from a benefits perspective.

 

Uh There’s also a term called business resource groups which also take a lot of this internal feedback and sharing of information about the needs of these different communities and then actually turn that into business opportunities thinking about. Well, if there are, for example, Guardian providing insurance and financial services products if there are specific products that could be a benefit to this segment of the workforce, because we know it’s helpful to our own colleagues, maybe this is something we should think about the public or how to market it a certain way.

 

So, so we’re learning from, so we’re learning from the er GS to benefit the organization from a cultural perspective, the health and productivity of the workforce. But also in terms of thinking about even, you know, business implications. And were you there at the start for the care that you called your care? I was one of the three founding members of the care er G. How did so was it, was it one of the first er GS or like did you have a formula? Oh OK. So was there like a formula that you had to follow?

 

Like if someone’s thinking, hey, I really want to try to start a care care focus er G where I work? Like what are the steps that you took? You know, I think there was enough going on in the market. Our senior leadership actually asked me so I, we didn’t have to propose it. I was actually tapped. So, no, I didn’t have to sell it at all. No. Uh they, we had done some research on it and published some research on the caregiving trends um in like 2019. Um And so I think there was some thought about, hey, maybe one of our er, g should be devoted to caregivers.

 

And so not long after that. Yeah, they asked me if I would be interested in two other colleagues of mine. And so, yeah, we’ve been two years this August. Ok. And typically it’s an unpaid role, like. Right, you’re doing, you’re doing it on top of your day job. Um, that’s, that’s what my, my experience. And then do you, you know what’s, yeah, just like, hey, yeah, you’re vol and told and, and, but you care about it enough that you want to see the change and you want to see the culture change and so that you’re the right, the right person for, for the, for the role.

 

Um What would you say, like, what’s working well at your, er G and maybe you know what’s not working well, but what are some of the things that you all do for your members, your community members? So I’ll talk about things we do and also talk, talk about things that we’ve learned, which were really beneficial. So, um in terms of what we do uh as a, as an, er, G, one of the very first things you want to do is pull the organization to find out. Well, how many caregivers do we have?

 

Because most organizations have no idea. Yeah. But people don’t self identify. So it’s almost like you can’t, you can’t even really say how many, how many caregivers, like how many people are doing this this, this, that, yeah. Right. So we created a survey uh which helped us to collect a lot of information uh about, you know, a few 1000 colleagues who responded and told us whether they’re a caregiver, who they’re providing care for. How long they’ve been doing it, what they identify some of the key challenges for them.

 

1. What topics are of greatest interest to them. If we were to be hosting events or providing them with content, what would be of greatest interest? So that really helped us to kind of build our year one plan, right? Our year one strategy for what we would do from a programming perspective, how we would communicate, you know, who we would be targeting within the organization. So, yeah. So today we have over 1100 active members of the er G. Yeah. Yeah. And, and that’s, you know, little over 10% of the total guardian population.

 

So there’s still a long way to go like there’s a lot of opportunity yet. And that’s because again, I think we, there’s still a lot of awareness raising to do about the K er G being for more than just those caring for the elderly. So I think we still have a ways to go. There’s, we, we talk to people all the time. Oh, I didn’t realize that. Yeah, somebody told me they were on this webinar. You guys did and it was about parents of young Children and we didn’t realize.

 

So I think that, you know, there’s still a long way to go in terms of just ramping up awareness. But so we provide a lot of content. So we have a monthly webinar or coffee chat. So if it’s coffee chat, it’s just colleagues sharing stories. If it’s a webinar, we usually bring in an outside speaker who has some expertise on a topic like geriatric care managers. We’ve brought in, we brought in people from, uh, one of our behavioral health programs to talk about mental health and me maintaining mental health as a caregiver.

 

Um, we talked to some of the caregiver resources that we have, like, concierge services, like a wealthy and had them come in and talk about what they do to support working caregivers. Um, talk about, yeah, those kinds of benefits. Right. Um, so that’s one of the major things that I think the, er, G has contributed to the organization is raising awareness about our benefits about our policies about what Guardian is actually doing to make life a little bit easier for our working caregivers. And again, many of them were just unaware of these things.

 

I mean, I can tell you I wasn’t aware where I worked, like of what I could have used, um, you know, until much later. Um, so it’s good that, you know, there wasn’t an, er, G for that and there wasn’t some of those things but it’s glad, you know, I’m glad that you’ve got, you know, different types of things. You’ve got educational webinars and content and like fast tracking them to resources knowing that they’re not alone and then the coffee chat to kind of just get things, air things out and um caregivers have the best ideas.

 

But, but beyond that, I think number one though, I started with the programming. But what that led to is people meeting each other. So when I said in the beginning, it’s about community, right? It’s about building community and it’s about strengthening the culture and that’s what’s been happening, which is more exciting than anything is having people come up to me and say, J I’ve never had a conversation before with a colleague about what I’m doing with my husband who is struggling with early dementia. And I’ve, I’ve met now five other colleagues who are going through the same thing and I had no idea and we’re talking about it and we’re sharing and it’s been really helpful. Yes. Yeah.

 

It’s the emotional therapy. Yeah. And it’s the practical things because I’m sure if they live in the same area, they could potentially connect to some resources that have been helpful for them. Uh And all of that makes it very accessible too. Um Do you have like um uh so you have the, the meetups? But do you also have a place to communicate in between meetings? Yes. So, yeah, we have uh basically our own like social media channel. So we have uh we use a platform known as Viva engage now for really yammer.

 

But it’s basically, you know, a water cooler type of uh you know, or Microsoft. So people can share and post articles or post questions uh around the holidays. We did um tips for how to uh enjoy the holidays if you’re a caregiver, like easy recipes or tips for going on vacation when you have an elderly parent with young Children. So that was, yeah, we got, I’m really impressed with the, yeah, and with the engagement that you built, like some, some organizations, their heart is in the right place as far as their, er, g but they have a hard time because they’re working their day job of putting some focused attention on it.

 

Um And that’s why, you know, like I, I have a package of support and services that I put together. We have the coverage to support, er GS with like leading a support group doing webinars, helping them moderate panel discussions, giving them content ideas for their channels. Um, but some, some companies are doing a great job on their own. Some people need a little more help with that and some people can maybe afford the big buck um, you know, platforms that um can do that. So working with people’s different budgets, but it’s, I, I’m really impressed in two years.

 

I think you should be proud of the engagement in the community. Um that you’re building. I know you don’t want the number of you felt like was not where you kind of thought it needed to be with your active members. But I, for somebody who works with, er, GS, it’s, I think it’s very impressive. Yeah, I only say that because based on our research, we know that like seven and 10 workers today meet that definition, this broader definition that we’ve been using in this conversation about who a caregiver is.

 

We know that like seven and 10 guardian colleagues probably have some kind of caregiving duties or expecting them to come and wouldn’t it be great to kind of get them before they’re like hair is on fire? You know, because I, I always share too that like the best day to find support and connection with other caregivers is on your best day. Like why wait until you’re in a crisis mode and then like, oh my gosh, what do I do next? It’s like if you can kind of get tip, tip your toe in and kind of just learn a little bit through osmosis.

 

Um especially like in your situation, you knew it was coming. And I think a lot of us, we can kind of anticipate um situations um like that, I mean, we, you know, in my family, my folks are deceased and so we, we anticipated that when that happened, our siblings, the siblings were going to have to, to um co-operate to help with one of my brothers who, um, has an intellectual and developmental disability. So you likely know. You know, but again, that’s very different than caring for an older adult.

 

So it’s like you’re in this whole new learning thing of needing support and resource. So every nuance is maybe a little bit different. Um, but, but well done, is there anything that like you, did you reference anything outside of your own, um, er GS at Guardian to or do you reference anything today outside to kind of inform you and fill your bucket about what, er GS are doing and how you could um to maybe add things to what you’ve already got. So we do have uh an equity and inclusion committee that kind of oversees the running of all of the, er GS. And so they provide us with benchmarking data.

 

We meet twice a year in person and usually at those meetings, we just had one in April. Uh they shared some benchmarking information about and, er G best practices. We had a guest speaker come in who consults with a lot of those large like fortune 500 companies around their E and I programs and, er GS. And so she gave us some, you know, great advice about how to continue to kind of move the needle forward with, er, and how to continue to get, you know, senior leadership support and budget and, and all of that. Yeah.

 

Yeah, budget and all of that. Exactly, because it’s like, you know, you want, you want to get the right, the right folks that are helping you all. Amazing. Well, um, anything else you want to add on the, er, g topic before we kind of switch to a self care. Um, the only other thing about the, er, g and this is kind of where we’re going and we started to go there in the second year but in our third year, which will begin in September. Um because this caregiving um community is so large and diverse, you know, we’ve talked about elder care, child care, Children with special needs generation, right?

 

Um And even when you say even, you know, spouse or partner care, each one a little bit different, had little nuances and probably have some of the different challenges and, and needs. Uh We’re really going to be breaking apart the er G, it’s gonna be one G but we now have like subgroups focused on each of those different segments of the community to develop programming and content and foster community. And it’s almost like a sub, sub community within the larger caregiver community. Just because the, we’re recognizing that the needs of each of those groups and what they might be interested in, in terms of content might be very different.

 

Yeah, like, I mean, there is this like umbrella of things that can help general caregivers as far as like your guardian benefits, maybe even like um self care type of mental health or caregivers overall. But then to your point, there are some nuanced things, dementia caregiving leads like a whole other type of thing then. Um So yeah, depending upon your condition, I can totally, totally see the need for that. Very cool. Well, I want to learn a little bit about your self care gene like when you were in the throes of being the serial caregiver over the years.

 

Like, what, what, how did you, my definition of self care is like anything that energizes you gives you peace of mind or it’s just plain joyful. Like, how did you, how did you check some of those boxes when you were raising kids, caring for older adults and your wife? It probably nothing all that exciting. And, um, but for me, um, I’m also a, uh, a deacon in the Catholic church and so my faith is very important to me. So, iii I would be, um, kidding myself and anyone else if I didn’t say it was my faith, that really was the number one thing that got me through all of it.

 

Um, especially when my wife, uh, had cancer. You know, I, I look back on that and people ask me like, well, you must, when they say, well, you must have really been having a rough time. That must have been horrible. And my recollection of it now is it wasn’t. And I, I just feel like I was floating through it and there was definitely a hand just guiding me through it. Like I wasn’t doing it on my own. I didn’t, I, I couldn’t have done it on my own and I feel like I didn’t.

 

So there was some kind of divine support that I was getting. That’s how I feel today. So there’s that there’s the faith and then secondly, my kids, you know, being, um, you know, I was working in New York and commuting an awful lot. But um I didn’t spend time doing much else other than work, you know, caring for the kids, caring for my wife and then ultimately with my parents, but family, you know, so it’s, it’s family and, and they were central and I spent as much time with my kids and to this day we just came back from a short vacation and I tell people my, you know, early thirties and late 20 year olds still want a vacation with, uh, their parents every year.

 

I think that’s a testament to, you know, the amount of time that we’ve spent together as a family and that we still kind of love being together. So I think my family, my kids, my faith kind of got me through it. Um I think those have been key. I like, you know what it is is it’s not like some, you know, mammoth thing that you got to go out and like, do these are little, little micro acts that you have infused in your years that, you know, keep you still standing upright and, and smiling and sharing about it.

 

So that’s important. Um Very cool. And what does self care look like for you now? Uh So now, yeah, so I said at the very beginning, right that the care uh journey continues. So now I have two grandchildren and one on the way. And so, uh it’s not a full time job yet. I’m still working as you can see. But, um, we have, uh, you know, two grandkids that we, my wife’s watching them twice a week and on those days, um, you know, I try and work from home so that I at least be around a little bit, spend some time.

 

So, yeah, we’re doing grandchildren, uh, caregiving now, which is different but awesome. I don’t know. That’s the best way I can describe it, you know, raising kids was fantastic. But grandchildren. And that’s not just because you can have, everybody says, yeah, you like that because you can just hand them off at the end of the day. No, it’s not that it’s just that there’s a different, I think you’re at a different point in your life where you can just appreciate that time. Uh, and how much love and goodness they bring into your life just like your kids did.

 

But you were probably too busy, stressed about, you know, raising a family and paying the mortgage and your job and practice your career. Yeah, there’s too much going on to really fully appreciate them. So now, like, I, we just, you know, you know, plenty of grandparents they, they’re showing off their pictures and the videos now and that’s where we are. Well, and you’re not the first person that, like, you know, I think sometimes people would be like, oh, you know, you mentioned it under the self care umbrella because I, I recently spoke to another guest who called be spending time with her grandkids and nonnegotiable because it really fed her, fed her soul, like filled it up with joy and it just, you know, it is energizing for her.

 

It can sound like raising, you know, caring for kids can be, can be exhausting. But it um in short stint like maybe what you’re doing. Um and your wife is doing like, it’s, it can be energizing and give you kind of a new perspective on things. Everybody’s different. I’m talking to one of my colleagues here and they said they were having a hard time getting their parents to watch the kids at all. They don’t get it. They’re like we thought they’d be like loving being great. So everybody’s different.

 

I mean, my parents were not, their view is, hey, we’ve done this already. Yes. My parents raised six kids and the grandkids came soon after to and they were made it very clear that they were not the kind of grandparents that were going to keep the kids for, um, you know, and everybody’s different. Everybody been through enough, you know, maybe of caregiving. Um, but yeah, we, um, we love it. So that is, I think self care in, in, in its own way is just spending time with them being able to kind of replay some of what, all the good times and what our great memories of raising our own kids. Yeah.

 

Even like the favorite books you had as a kid or the activities or you want to teach them. Um, I can’t tell you how many little people I’ve taught how to, um, shuffle a deck of cards and make the little bridge and, you know, it’s like I remember an older person teaching me how to do that or how to write bike or like those kinds of things. Stick with you for sure. Surprised that more people. So, you’re right about that. Uh, for me, that’s a self care thing I think for my wife too is, it’s almost like reliving your youth a little bit.

 

You know, when you, when you spent time with your kids, you did too. You know, I pulled out the old hot wheels set that I had as a, as a, when they brought back tremendous memories and now we’re playing wiffle ball with my son in the backyard. Like, oh, I used to do that, you know, with my cousins and my dad and we, you know, brought back great memories. Well, now, the same thing with my grandkids. So it’s an opportunity to kind of, you know, go back in time yet again, you know, at a time where maybe it even means more, you know, it’s, it’s, it means something different now when you’re at this stage rather than when you’re a parent. Yeah.

 

Yeah, it’s, it’s sweet. Very sweet. Well, I’ve got a few questions to ask you from the just for you daily self care journal jean. So let’s see what your thoughts are. This is, you know, these were intended to be prompts to help people put more focus on their own health and happiness. Um I’m not sure if you’ll have an answer for this one but maybe share a boundary that you set or maybe that you need to set to create more me, more me time for yourself, more alone, time for yourself and be time for yourself.

 

Did you have to set a boundary or kind of do anything? Um Even with work life balance. Was there anything there? Um Yeah, you know, I, I can’t say that it was like a conscious thing, but I would say and I didn’t mention this before. I guess I’ve always tried to continue to do things that I enjoy, right? And, and, and I didn’t have like a grand plan around it and nothing set in stone like I’ve got to do this X times A month or something. But, you know, I enjoy going to baseball games and I’ve had, you know, tickets to see the Yankees for years and years.

 

My uncle passed them down to me. And so I continue to do that and I take the kids and so I would, I would make sure that I would still do that, you know, for many, many years. So I, I, the things that I enjoy, I try to keep doing, you know, I think it’s a grand idea to have like some kind of repeat thing, whether it’s like, you know, theater tickets or something you enjoy and it’s like the date is happening and it kind of forces the, the moments that happen because sometimes I think you can look back and you’re like, whoa, I haven’t done like, I haven’t had a date with myself or, you know, in a long time so it can kind of scheduling self care is, is a, is a master tip, I think on, on that, in a way the baseball schedule helped you do that baseball schedule and go, and my wife likes going to the movies.

 

She’ll go to baseball games but doesn’t enjoy that as much as going to the movies. So we do that. We make sure we’re, you know, going fairly often. So, yeah, those are things that, that we do. But so I don’t know if it was like setting a boundary per se or saying, but we definitely made it a point of continuing to try and do things, you know, together, especially, like going to dinner or going to a movie. Um, and then things that I would do with my kids just so that we weren’t always in the throes of caregiving. Yeah.

 

When my parents were, yeah, it’s important, important to have those, those moments. Um, any ideas or things that you’re doing to slow down and enjoy life a little bit more. Uh Well, I would say, you know, spending that time with the grandkids when I can, um still working as of now, uh you know, getting closer to retirement every day. And so, yeah, I think, you know, as I, as I uh get closer to retirement, I’m getting more and more excited about, you know, being able to do some different things and having more time on my hands.

 

Um and maybe doing some of the things that I’ve been doing like part time, like, you know, working with the caregiver community like you are, but maybe doing, spending more time on that, spending more time with my uh ministry as a deacon as well. So it’s a great opportunity, you know, an entry point for many caregivers, you know, through the health care system to kind of, you know, be identified as their caregiver. Here’s some resources and support thing out of there and then your role that you have in your faith community is also a great place to kind of share that with people and get that message out so you can fast track them to support resources.

 

You’re kind of doing it and all the. Yeah. Well, it can be true. Like there can be times where I think, like, if you’re in a care role, like I’ve met many caregivers over the year that if, if they’re nurse or they’re a social worker or, you know, working, um, with people who need a lot of hands on care and then they come home and have that too. Like it can be very exhausting to constantly be on this care wheel all the time. You do have to kind of make, make time for, to, to reenergize.

 

Um I didn’t have that kind of job. I had a, you know, a strategic and it job for many years. So sometimes coming to work was felt like respite in a weird way because I knew I knew how to do the job, maybe the challenges that came up, but it wasn’t like the end of the world and it just, you know, where you’re not dealing with a lot of emotions and opinions on family exhausting. Yeah. Yeah. Um Last question for you is what foods do you consume that?

 

Make you feel energized coffee. I have to say coffee, coffee, coffee. So I, I love coffee and um I didn’t start drinking until I was working. So I was in my mid twenties. But I think I drank so much coffee that my son started to really enjoy. I think the aroma of coffee when he was in high school. And by the time he was in college, he had bought himself a Capucci like an expensive cappuccino maker. Um And so he has become like a coffee connoisseur and there’s almost a coffee snob like he can’t drink a cup of coffee unless he’s made it from like, you know, premium beans.

 

And so I, I’d say coffee is uh something that we now share. Um I love that it can be a little like ritual self care moment. I know it is for me in the morning. Like there are times where I’m like, and then like I can make it to the coffee bar and make myself a little, you know, I use an espresso machine um but put some cinnamon in it, some vanilla, you know, froth up my thing in my little espresso frother and I feel like I’m treating myself almost to a Starbucks that way. Yeah.

 

How do you like your coffee anyway? Yeah, I am, I am not a coffee so I, I just like any coffee as long as it’s coffee, I enjoy it. I like flavored coffee, unflavored coffee, cappuccino, espresso anything. You’re sounding like Bubba Gump right now. You know, it doesn’t have to be Starbucks, it could be 7-Eleven or whatever the local like f are you, you’re in the northeast? So isn’t it? Everything’s Dunkin donuts. I feel like up there Dunkin Donuts, lots of Dunkin donuts. So, yeah, for me, coffee maybe.

 

And pizza, pizza, I mean, yeah, in New Jersey, the pizza is fantastic. New York, New Jersey pizza is fantastic. So, yeah, that’s, that’s the water, right? That’s what they say. The water makes the better pizza and the better bagel. Yeah. II, I wouldn’t mind some of that right now. That sounds lovely. Um, well, is there anything gene that you wish that we would have highlighted and talked about? Are there things that the public can get from the things that you’re doing at Guardian that may be um, complimentary to them?

 

Um, anything else that you want to just kind of highlight before we sign off? Um, some of the research that we’ve done address things that we’ve talked about today around caregiver, challenges and needs and resources that are available through their employers. So if you don’t have an, er, G, first of all, I would probably make sure that you’re asking the question because there might be an, er G and you might not even be aware. So if you are working and you’re a working caregiver, uh definitely find out if your organization has an employee resource group and ask what, what kinds of services, what kinds of programming, what kinds of content uh and maybe even opportunities to get involved if you’re interested.

 

So that would be one thing. Um, we, and then we do produce a fair amount of research uh among caregivers. So you might find some content related to, you know, things that you’re dealing with challenges that you’re facing and some suggested uh resources and solutions within that. So I, I think maybe that so on our website, maybe that’s something that you’re gonna make available to put a link in the, in the um in the show notes to that. And I’ll also put a link, I’ve written some posts about how to start your own, a resource group focused on caregivers, some of the steps there.

 

Um I also wrote one about how to like build the engagement on that and grow your community. So I’ll share a couple of those links too in case people are just trying to like suck in all the resources. Um And this gives you, gives you ideas of things that you can, you can either, yeah, get involved with or, or think about starting because I, I think it really matters. Yeah, that, that, that’s the key takeaway. There’s just today, there’s so much more information available, there’s so many more resources than what I was going through the my period of sandwich generation.

 

So um take advantage of all of those great resources, all the great hr policies and benefits that are making, you know, it easier to try and balance the caregiving with your work responsibilities. Yeah, that’s, that’s what I’m excited to kind of even see that even get developed more. I just thank you for kind of bringing all of this to light and giving people. I think hope that are working caregivers of some of the things that they can do so that they feel supported and um and connected and not so isolated in this journey.

 

And thanks for just being vulnerable also and sharing your story and sharing your joys as well. Oh, thank you. Thanks Elizabeth. It was a pleasure.

 

Do you enjoy listening to podcasts? So do I and I’m always up to support a fellow Carp Prene whose podcasts I value Nicole will host of navigating the world with your aging loved one explores the world of aging and care. As a former guest, I can tell you that Nicole’s podcast has an ideal mix of practical tools and resources and messages of hope and encouragement. You can find Nicole wherever you download your favorite podcast or go to her website will gather.com

 

Thanks for joining us today on the Happy Healthy caregiver podcast on the whole care network. As always, show notes that a company today’s episode can be found on my website Happy Healthy caregiver.com. Just look under the podcast menu for today’s episode image and that will take you to the page with the links and information we spoke about today. You’ll also find other resources on the website along with links to purchase the just for you daily self care journal.

 

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